(Message jeffa:318)
Subj: [L5RINFO] rulings for 12-13 February 2000
From: Jeff Alexander <jwa0@EARTHLINK.NET>

  To: L5RINFO@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM
Date: Tue, 15 Feb 2000 01:38:49 PST
X-Accept-Language: ja
-- /blue/homes/cowell/Mail/mhl.format --

>From:    Matt Scellato <RobinOfC@AOL.COM>
>Subject: Ninube Ogoku question
>
>   I know that just about every question that could be asked about Ogoku
>probably has been answered by now, but I don't recall seeing this one
>brought
>up. For those who don't remember her, here is the card text.
>
><<Ninube Ogoku
>2F / 2C
>- / 5 / 1
>Unaligned Ninja - Followers must be Ninja.
>Ogoku can join any army, including an army attacking your Provinces,
>regardless of whether you have been invited to that battle. You never gain
>Honor when Ogoku joins an army.>>
>
>  Here's the question: If I move Ogoku to another battle, does she have to
>stay on the same side of the battle? If I assign her as the Defender, and
>then move her to a different battle, can she become an Attacker? Is moving
>to a different battle considered joining an army at that battle?

     From the archives:  "Effects that move units between Provinces
cannot move her from one side of the battle to the other."

;;;;;

>From:    Brandon Flores <protomew@HOTMAIL.COM>
>Subject: Touching the Void question [Jeff]
>
>We all should know that Touching the Void's extra card bonus comes when you
>have an empty hand.  *But*...nowhere in the Accum. Rulings does it say how
>exactly that works.
>
>Can I dump a Touching in my Limited, dump my hand through various ways and
>means, then draw 5 at the end of my turn?
>
>-OR-
>
>Do I play Touching the Void as my last card action (being the last card in
>my hand) in order to draw five at the end of the turn.
>
>As of right now, the wording is so loose you can do either or and get away
>with it.  I'd like to see a static rule on this before S@M comes about and
>no one tries to pull anything fancy with the card.

     It says "upon playing this card".  It only checks right as
you play it.

;;;;;

>From:    Kakita Yasuyo <yasuyo@MINDRUSH.COM.AU>
>Subject: A question [Jeff,Dave]
>
>If I use Within Your Soul to swap Force and Chi and have 1-3 Dragonfly
>Fortresses in play does my Chi change to my Force and then
>gain the Dragon Fly Fortress bonus or does it stay as my Force.
>
>Eg Shioda with 3 Fortresses in play is a 1F/7C Monk when he uses Within Your
>Soul on himself he becomes
>a) a 7f/1C Monk
>or
>b) a 7F/4C Monk ???

     You're exchanging 1 and 7, so you get 7 and 1.

     Here's something that's been in the FAQ for awhile that might
help explain it.  It deals with copying a stat rather than switching
two, but the underlying basis is the same:  you're changing a stat
directly to another number.

] Q: I have a Ninja Shapeshifter, initially 2F/2C with a +2/+2 weapon
] token, and I want him to copy an Ogre Bushi's Force of 6.  That means
] the Ninja becomes a total 8F/4C creature, right?  Six Force from the
] Ogre, plus two from the weapon?
]
] A: Actually, no.  Check out p. 28 again:
]
] "If a card copies a value from another card, the current value of the
]  card being copied replaces the current value of the copying card."
]
] The important phrase is "current value", which is the base value plus
] *all* modifiers.  The current value of your Ninja's Force before the
] shapechange is 4:  a base of 2 plus 2 for the weapon.  After the change
] it's 6, since that's what the Ogre's current Force is.  Since this 6 is
] now the Ninja's current Force, we don't add anything to it -- "current
] value" already includes all bonuses and penalties.
]
] If your NSS has any kind of a weapon, you'll almost always end up in a
] situation where The Whole Is Not Equal to The Sum of the Parts if you
] copy someone else's Force or Chi.  In our example above, the +2F from
] his own sword apparently disappears.  The sword doesn't change from
] a +2/+2 weapon into something else, nor does the NSS's base Force of 2
] change.  What does happen when you copy a stat is that you stop using
] basic math to figure his total and just use the copied value on faith
] (plus or minus any further changes that happen *after* the shapeshift,
] of course).  That's ninja trickery for you.

;;;;;

>From:    Upeer <Upeer@TIR.COM>
>Subject: Rules Questions from Open this weekend [Jeff]
>
>     I played in an open tournament this weekend and was surprised how many
>weird card interactions we encountered I wanted to post a couple to get an
>official ruling on if I may.
>
>1.  Peasant Revolt resolves, my opponent bows everything of his with 3F+
>Then the revolt goes to the discard, my opponent then wants to play
>Jurojin's Touch to end the continuing effects?  There is a line in the
>accumulated rulings saying that the touch does not effect stuff that
>destroys itself like events.  This means this play is not legal correct?

     Correct.  Jurojin's Touch is really quite limited in its use.
In fact, the FAQ even uses Peasant Revolt as an example!

] Q: Jurojin's Touch says the card I remove "may not...have an effect
] on play by any means".  If a card, like Peasant Revolt, has an
] ongoing effect, can I use Jurojin's Touch to end it early?
]
] A: No.  Jurojin's Touch won't cancel any effects already set in
] motion, only brand-new effects that come from or refer to dead or
] discarded cards, such as returning to play or counting towards a
] Clan Banner or Bon Festival.  It's just a reminder that the card
] is completely gone from the game now, not in the discard pile.

>2.  Ki-Rin's Shrine and Corruption tokens.  The Ki rin's shrine says that my
>personalities Chi may not be reduced below thier personal honor, unless one
>of my cards is causing the chi loss. When I unbow with a black scroll
>attached i get a -1C corruption token.  Now the way I read both cards that
>means the Chi loss comes from the token and not my card effect right?  This
>means that i can pile the corruption tokens on all day long and never have
>my Chi go below my personal honor right?

     Right.

;;;;;

>From:    Dean McNabb - Tegel <DeanM@TEGEL.CO.NZ>
>Subject: Re: RULES QUESTION
>
>>Thanks. When I saw Jeff the other night I asked him and he said exactly what
>>you have relayed.
>>
>>Brian Duff
>>Crab World Order
>
>[DM] You mean there actually is a Jeff Alexander? He's not a figment of our
>collective imagination??

     Nope.  Just my own.

;;;;;

>From:    Brian Duff <RUGBY4HIRE@AOL.COM>
>Subject: Re: Touching the Void question [Jeff]
>
>In a message dated 2/13/00 4:36:45 PM Pacific Standard Time,
>DeanM@TEGEL.CO.NZ writes:
>
><< Touching the Void
> 0G 2F
> Limited: If you have no cards in your hand upon playing this card,
> permanently lower you maximum hand size by one. Draw four extra cards
>during
> your End Phase this turn.
>
> ...only works if your hand is empty upon playing Touching The Void i.e. it
> has to be the last card in your hand.
>  >>
>
>I disagree. It says, "If you have no cards in your hand upon playing this
>card..." By using the word "if" it means that you may play this card anytime
>during your limited phase. When you play it as the last card out of hand
>your hand size is lowered by one, otherwise there is no effect upon you
>hand size.

     The problems with the wording of this card became immediately
obvious as soon as it hit the stores.  You're absolutely right -- it
doesn't really work the way it looks like it should.  That's entirely
because the way it looks like it should work would make it THE most
broken card in L5R.

;;;;;

>From:    Leon Phillips <Sphynx@AOL.COM>
>Subject: [Jeff] Rules questions
>
>Ok, here are some questions. The first came up in a tournament, the others
>could well do depending upon the ruling.
>
>1) If I play The Great Silence in a battle, can my opponent play Rallying
>Cry?  In other words, is the battle action phase over immediately after
>resolution or when the next battle is declared?

     The Battle Action Segment ends *before* the Resolution Segment.
The Great Silence doesn't even stop things like Feign Death (which
Deadly Ground does).

>2) Suppose I possess Oni no Pekkle with a Toku.  I then Egg of Pan Ku the
>possessed critter.
>      a) If the Egg is destroyed, what happens?  Does a Pekkle poof into
>existence so it can become "returneded to play" and the Egg go to my
>honorable dead pile?
>      b) If so, can I use Yori to bring the Egg back and kill it again next
>turn to create Pekkles from nothing?
>      c) If so, what would happen if it was a unique oni that was possessed?
>Would that override the one unique personality in play rule?

     The original Oni Personality would only return to play the first
time either Possession-creature is killed -- after that, it's already
in play and cannot "return" again.

;;;;;

>From:    Java Bistro <JavaBistro@AOL.COM>
>Subject: [Jeff] Can I target Dishonorable Dead People with Shame?
>
>Rules Question:
>
>Jeff
>
>Can I target a dishonorable personality in my opponents dead pile with
>Shame?

     You cannot normally target cards which are not in play.
Shame doesn't have any wording that makes it an exception.  No.

;;;;;

>From:    Jon Paulson <Takezo1385@AOL.COM>
>Subject: [Jeff] Rules Q's
>
>Scouting Team Question.
> The scouting teams second ability is to destroy themselves to negate the
>use
>of tactician or a "tatics" card. I know you may destroy the team to negate a
>superior tactics being played by the opponent, but can you do so if there is
>a deadly ground in play. Does deadly prevent their reaction?

     Deadly Ground does, in fact, prevent reactions like this one.

>Egg/ False Hoturi Question.
>    Since the egg is a legal action in ex jade, what about the false Hoturi?
>(since they are treated as the same card for construction and play) I don't
>think he is but want to check anyways.

     He might be the Egg, but he's also a Personality card.  He's not
legal.

>(Personality) Ancestors and unique traits
>    Several people now have ancestors that count as them. My question is
>since they have no experienced "x" trait how do these cards work for deck
>construction? Are you able to have the ancestor and the unique personality
>in the deck, just not in play at the same time? And I'm assuming non unique
>versions (such as Tadaka) can still be played regardless.
>
>    The other question I had was is it possible to have the great bear and
>shiryo no Kiasada in play at same time? (or no since they both count as
>Kisada)

     From the FAQ:

] Q: I have a card which isn't a Personality but which counts as one
] for Uniqueness.  Can I put it in a deck with the Experienced or
] Inexperienced version of that Personality?  What about Lord Moon's
] Blood and the Obsidian Mirror?
]
] A: If one card counts as another for Uniqueness, you may not have any
] Unique versions of that other card in either of your decks.  You may
] have the full amount of non-Unique versions, both in your deck and
] in play with it.  A deck with Lord Moon's Blood can still have three
] Obsidian Mirrors.
]
] If the card itself is not a Personality but the card it counts
] against is, it counts against *all* experience levels of that
] Personality.  A deck with Shriyo no Tadaka cannot have either Isawa
] Tadaka Exp or Isawa Tadaka Exp2, but it can still have three of the
] original Isawa Tadaka since he's not Unique.

;;;;;

>From:    Jon Paulson <Takezo1385@AOL.COM>
>Subject: [Jeff] Another Rules Q
>
>Judgement of Toshiken.
>
>    How I read the card is that it pretty much blanks out the text boxes on
>cards focused in a duel... using only printed focus values (save toshimoko
>sen.)  If such understanding works, Does "burning your essence" and "let you
>spirit guide you" have a focus values of 0 when using Judgement?
>
>Also since it gets rid of "in duel" bonuses/penalties, does Judgment negate
>the bonuses from cards such as bend like a reed and strike with no thought?

     I'll tentatively say "0" and "yes", but I'm also waiting for Dave
and Zen's inputs.

;;;;;

>From:    Jon Paulson <Takezo1385@AOL.COM>
>Subject: Re: rulings for 8-11 February 2000
>
>In a message dated 2/14/00 4:10:57 PM EST, chuckk@DECIPHER.COM writes:
>
><< Does Toshimoko Sensei add to:
>      Bend Like A Reed?
>      Strike With No-Thoght?
>
> Does Double Chi double the effect of:
>      Bend Like A Reed?
>      Strike With No-Thought? >>
>
>As of Jeff's post.
>Yes
>and
>Yes
>
>Double chi has always applied to bend and strike, what was unclear was if
>Toshimoko appied to bend (which now has be fixed)

     Thanks, Jon.  That sums it up exactly.


                         ___________________________________
Jeff Alexander          ( Legend of the Five Rings FAQ site (O
Phoenix Clan Scribe      )    http://www.zdi.net/jwa/l5r     )
                        (___________________________________(O

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